Brahms' Più Andante

[Yinyue]

Hi Forum,

Quick question on this:

More Andante: did Brahms mean 'slower than' or 'faster than' Andante?

Thanks,
Best

[John Ruggero]

That's a great question. I think that it may be context-driven.

In the op. 117 no. 1 the Un poco piu Andante seems to mean more motion than the Piu Adagio that precedes it. But maybe it really means less motion than the opening Andante? In the Symphony no. 1 4th movement intro. the Piu Andante seems to mean more motion than the Adagio before it. But in the Waltz op. 39 no. 7 the Poco piu Andante seems to mean less motion than the preceding Vivace.

So Brahms seems to use the term Andante in its modern sense simply as a tempo between Allegretto and Adagio, rather than the more literal one of "moving", and piu Andante just means a return to a Andante tempo or a slowish Andante. The slow movement Piano Sonata no. 3 starts Andante espressivo. The coda is marked Andante molto (which is somewhat like piu Andante) on the way to the ending, which is Adagio. So I play the Andante molto slower that the opening Andante, not with more movement than the opening Andante.

But that's just a guess. One would have to look through all of his works to work this out.

[OCTO]

Knowing Brahms, I would guess a bit slower. More walking, wider steps, than going, but definitely not toward running.

[Yinyue]

Awesome, thanks for sharing.

[John Ruggero]

You are very welcome, Yinyue. I hope you will keep asking your questions and making comments. It's a win-win for everyone.